Got Church?
Occasionally I still find myself nudged and prodded to attend church on my precious Sunday mornings. The service usually gets out before the football pre-game shows are over so I oblige from time to time. Our church, Southern Baptist, recently opened a new 5,000 seat facility, so I was eager to get a look.
Despite my being ardently anti-religion and anti-faith, the institution of the church intrigues me. Our new church, or maybe complex is the better word, looks like a cross between the Jerusalem Temple and a Busch Gardens ride. It's quite impressive. It made me feel quite happy to tell you the truth, to see such a great structure brought about by nothing but the voluntary actions of like minded people, freedom at its best, in a way. It's the sitting in church that provides the real lessons though, not the structure.
As anyone who attends a church will readily tell you, the church isn't the building, it isn't the preacher, although those help. The church is ultimately the people. The church provides something crucial to people that, to my mind, nothing else provides. what it provides is community, in the real sense of the word. A support structure that spans all facets of life.
A school presents different methods of living. A church tells you which is good, and helps you live it. Work provides you with money and achievement. Church tells you what to do with it and what it's worth. Sports tells our kids how to win. Church teaches them why they play.
The church sets foundational principles that so many people seem to lack. It's upon those principles, the Bible in this case, that people rally around. They come together every Sunday to study those foundations. They sing. They put on plays and skits. They send their kids to Sunday school to supplement their deficient public school educations. They have sports teams, social clubs and festivals. Half of what the church does has little if anything to do with God. So why do church going folk do it? Why do they attend just to sing some songs or go on a hay ride?
People are social animals. Combine this with the fact that none of us are perfect and you see why the church is such a vital institution. The community that the church offers helps people. They help people better understand their beliefs. They help raise children. They help take care of the elderly members of the group. They help when individuals struggle. They help people socialize and enjoy life. Where else but church do so many people volunteer so many hours to participate in choirs and orchestras? What other institution has people volunteering to teach kids and teenagers and referee baseball games? What other institution has people volunteering ten percent of their income?
I abhor most of the foundational beliefs that church's rely upon and teach to their members. But, having said that, I do feel that the role the church plays in the lives of its members is a crucial one that most, if not all, individuals could benefit from. This is why it saddens me so much to see that their is no real equivalent of the church in the secular world.
If their is one great failing of secularism, and it may indeed be a great one, it is its failure to recognize the human need for a social community and the philosophical foundations that community must rest on. In their quest to disprove the existence of God, they have failed to build their own self-supporting community structures. This failure has left those who find no truth in religion to wander aimlessly in search of meaning and purpose, truth and stability, leaving them confused, susceptible to false claims such as religion or subjectivism, and often creating individuals that are detached and ultimately unhappy.
The need for fellowship exists, even among the non-religious. I don't think that a secular society will successfully come to fruition until this vital need is met. I hope I am there to see that day, and will do my best to make it come to pass.
Fly Higher,
Icarus Goodman
Despite my being ardently anti-religion and anti-faith, the institution of the church intrigues me. Our new church, or maybe complex is the better word, looks like a cross between the Jerusalem Temple and a Busch Gardens ride. It's quite impressive. It made me feel quite happy to tell you the truth, to see such a great structure brought about by nothing but the voluntary actions of like minded people, freedom at its best, in a way. It's the sitting in church that provides the real lessons though, not the structure.
As anyone who attends a church will readily tell you, the church isn't the building, it isn't the preacher, although those help. The church is ultimately the people. The church provides something crucial to people that, to my mind, nothing else provides. what it provides is community, in the real sense of the word. A support structure that spans all facets of life.
A school presents different methods of living. A church tells you which is good, and helps you live it. Work provides you with money and achievement. Church tells you what to do with it and what it's worth. Sports tells our kids how to win. Church teaches them why they play.
The church sets foundational principles that so many people seem to lack. It's upon those principles, the Bible in this case, that people rally around. They come together every Sunday to study those foundations. They sing. They put on plays and skits. They send their kids to Sunday school to supplement their deficient public school educations. They have sports teams, social clubs and festivals. Half of what the church does has little if anything to do with God. So why do church going folk do it? Why do they attend just to sing some songs or go on a hay ride?
People are social animals. Combine this with the fact that none of us are perfect and you see why the church is such a vital institution. The community that the church offers helps people. They help people better understand their beliefs. They help raise children. They help take care of the elderly members of the group. They help when individuals struggle. They help people socialize and enjoy life. Where else but church do so many people volunteer so many hours to participate in choirs and orchestras? What other institution has people volunteering to teach kids and teenagers and referee baseball games? What other institution has people volunteering ten percent of their income?
I abhor most of the foundational beliefs that church's rely upon and teach to their members. But, having said that, I do feel that the role the church plays in the lives of its members is a crucial one that most, if not all, individuals could benefit from. This is why it saddens me so much to see that their is no real equivalent of the church in the secular world.
If their is one great failing of secularism, and it may indeed be a great one, it is its failure to recognize the human need for a social community and the philosophical foundations that community must rest on. In their quest to disprove the existence of God, they have failed to build their own self-supporting community structures. This failure has left those who find no truth in religion to wander aimlessly in search of meaning and purpose, truth and stability, leaving them confused, susceptible to false claims such as religion or subjectivism, and often creating individuals that are detached and ultimately unhappy.
The need for fellowship exists, even among the non-religious. I don't think that a secular society will successfully come to fruition until this vital need is met. I hope I am there to see that day, and will do my best to make it come to pass.
Fly Higher,
Icarus Goodman










15 Comments:
Thanks for a novel and thougtful post.
Religion and secularism are not enemies, they are choices.
That is freedom to chose what you believe.
I wrote about the same thing, but perhaps you did it better.
By
Allan, at 9:44 PM
The secular world will never, ever have the kind of fellowship that true believers in Jesus Christ have. The secular world will always be every man for himself. Non-believers constantly are looking for something they will never find. They look for it in sex, money, power, drugs, sports, fame, and false religions. Why is it that people will look to and be willing to believe ANYTHING EXCEPT the TRUTH? People will believe in space aliens, bigfoot, the loch-ness monster, Kabbalah, yoga, karma, and all sorts of crazyness. But explain to them the Truth- that Jesus Christ is The Way, The Truth, and The Life and they will laugh. False idols are everywhere. Not just little statues of bhudda or whatever, but anything that man elevates above God is a false idol. Icarus, you are waiting for something that can never happen. I know you think that man can accomplish anything with perseverance and out of their own will, but you are wrong. I am truly baffled by you Icarus. You appear to be extremely brilliant, but you refuse to believe the obvious truth. You must think I'm an idiot to have faith in Jesus Christ, but i assure you, I am not. A long time ago I took my leap of faith and believed, and since then my eyes could see and my ears could hear what you continuosly turn your back to- the very Truth you seek. You want to know the origin of the universe, the future of mankind , or even the purpose of existence itself? Well I Know those answers. I know them because God has told us the answers in the Bible. Why look to science or other false religions (objectivism) for the answers? They are in the Bible! I know I am sounding arrogant, and that's not my intention. I just dont understand how anyone can be so thick-headed. You know, this is almost like arguing with a liberal. How do liberals not see that they are clearly wrong? Satan is a tricky bastard I guess. Ok, I tend to write more on your blog than my own and I dont mean to take up all your space, so maybe I'll talk more about this on mine later. Icarus, I hope you dont take my comments as being mean-spirited, this time or ever. I was not always a true believer, and had some of the same questions as you. I just chose to believe the truth and I hope soon you will do the same.
By
ezekiel, at 11:09 PM
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By
jollybeggar, at 3:03 PM
careful ezekiel... you don't know what you're inviting in using the word 'liberal!' LOL
***
anyway, i just thought about all of this and realized that much of the lengthy comment which i hammered out could be posted on my own blog... so i won't clutter up the workspace here for 'pastor's forum.'
but i would like to know, my friend, how the institutional church can have such abhorant foundational beliefs, and yet be of such acclaimed social value. shouldn't something of such poor foundation be more harm than good?
if you would expound upon this a bit, it would help me to understand your view better.
By
jollybeggar, at 3:11 PM
This is in response to Ezekial's comment:
No worries man! I don't take what you said to be mean spirited at all. You probably don't know much about me, so let me assure you that I understand where you are coming from. A few years ago I would probably have felt the same as you. Just like you said that you once were lost and then found Christ, I consider myself to have once been lost (when I was a Christian up until the age of 19) and then was found when I rejected that "truth."
Just as you said that accepting Christ into your life was an illuminating expereince, I feel the same way about rejecting it. Once I rejected religion it was as if everything in life became so much clearer, things made a lot more sense.
When I was Christian, I felt that Christ made sense, it was my foundational belief. It wasn't until I rejected it and was able to view religion from an outside perspective that I truly saw its nature. Now the whole idea of religion baffles me, just as my stance seems to baffle you.
You say that the Truth is found in the Bible, I used to think so too, just answer me how you know this. How do you know that what the Bible says is true.
And please, never compare me to a Liberal, we try not to use such dirty putdowns here ;)
By
Icarus Goodman, at 8:59 AM
In response to Jolybeggar:
The church is good as a community center. It acts as a kind of substitute for many people of what men used to have in neighborhoods and othe such orginizations. Secular people do get some of this need from other sources, maybe some club or a sports league, but nothing that has the integrated comprehensivness of a church.
Most of the church activities, the ones i said were good at least, have little to do with God. They may be talking about God and studying his word, but in my mind that is truly a secondary consideration for those attending. They could study their Bibles by themselves at home if they wanted. Its the commraderie, the human unteraction, the sense of belonging and the mutually beneficial human relationships that one finds at church that really makes them go, God just happens to be the underlying current of thought that binds all the activities together.
The main idea that is abhorent is faith. The same faith in the same God and the same sacred writing. This really just acts as a topic, the topic that all the activities are baseed upon. You can replace faith with any number of things, and people have. First every different religion has some sort of churh community, even though the underlying faith is differnt, even Scientologists have a community based on space aliens and other nonsense. Some people have communities based on what college they went to, or their career field.
But for secularists, a community based on a career field isn't going to satisfy all the needs. Because it isn't based on one all-encompasing view of existence.
That is the most important part. Just like religious communities are based on one underlying principle that all followers believe and everyhting else is predicated on, so must a secular community, to be successful, be based on some one foundational philosophy.
Replace faith with objectivity, reason, all those good things that we secualrists love and you get a community just like church but with god.
By
Icarus Goodman, at 9:12 AM
Sorry about the liberal comment. I know there's not much worse to be called than that.:) I've decided that I will try to explain the reasons for believing what I believe and for believing that the Bible is the word of God. Just give me some time, I'd like to do a little research first. Explaining 'why' to someone that views 'faith' as misguided will be difficult, but I am confident that God can give me (or someone else) the specific words to say to you. I know you dont expect me to PROVE anything, since that of course would defeat the whole purpose of faith, but I will instead attempt to convince/persuede/show you that belief and faith in God is the MOST LOGICAL and RIGHT path. Your previous history of church-going and beliefs is promising to me. You said the church you attended was southern-baptist; I myself attend a baptist church which I believe teaches the word of God more accuratley than other denominations. Most people consider baptist to be another protestant denomination right along with all the others, which is incorrect. Protestant (notice 'protest') denominations came from the reformation. So they came out of the Catholic church while the baptists were there all along. Man, can I ramble on or what!? So anyway, Icarus my freind I'll probably post my whole 'reasons for faith' deal on my blog semi-soon. I'll of course let you know when that happens. One more thought before I go: isnt it weird how everyone hates writing papers and researching topics in school, but if it's something we care about we'll research all day and night and type and type and type like it's going out of style. Thanks for reading!
-ezekiel
By
ezekiel, at 11:32 PM
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By
jollybeggar, at 10:42 AM
i learned something about the differences between the eastern and western worlds this past summer in preparation for my mission to sri lanka...(sounds pretty covert)
a fundamental difference between eastern and western thought is the western presumption that things without specific labels and direct applications are irrelevent tangents. whereas westerners drive hard for the most direct intellectual route between points a and b, easterners tend to start at a and circle b a number of times, taking in the whole context of b with its surrounding topography, vegetation, geology and weather in order to more completely embrace it in conclusion.
so, my point? just because people are not specifically operating in their 'God' box, explicitly studying theology or bible history or whatever, does not mean that they aren't implicitly engaging.
life is a celebration of its author.
http://e-pistles.blogspot.com/2005/11/built-for-relation-not-simply.html
By
jollybeggar, at 12:46 PM
Ok Ezekial, maybe I was asking the wrong question earlier. You seem to be conceding that believing in God takes Faith. Most would. SO i guess maybe the real question I should ask you is what is faith, and why should I have it? What is it about faith that makes you ascribe to it?
By
Icarus Goodman, at 1:00 PM
Well written. Although not denying the basis need for people form communities, I believe the individual can build inner strength against the challange of our existential lonelyness: http://frankamand.blogspot.com/
By
the son, at 3:51 PM
I agree Frank. Personally I can be quite satisfied even in solitude. Many people however are no tlike that. I think the community aspect of religion is one of its big reasons for success and I doubt that a secular society will gain much ground without providing that community that is currently provided only by religious institutions.
By
Icarus Goodman, at 8:09 PM
"When I was Christian, I felt that Christ made sense, it was my foundational belief. It wasn't until I rejected it and was able to view religion from an outside perspective that I truly saw its nature. Now the whole idea of religion baffles me, just as my stance seems to baffle you."
nicely worded. i thumped out something recently in someone's comment box that (because i can never think up anything new on demand) i just pasted as a new post.
so much about who we are has to do with the exchange of ideas and interaction.
http://e-pistles.blogspot.com/2005/11/culturally-sanctified-set-apart.html
By
jollybeggar, at 5:13 PM
Very good post, Icarus. But have you ever considered that maybe the reason that the Church can supply this fellowship and meet such a deep need in people is that it in fact is not based on "false claims" but rather on genuine reality; and the reason secularism cannot supply these things is that it is based on falsehood? If not, what explanation is there?
By
Gary B, at 7:01 PM
gary b- nicely put.
By
jollybeggar, at 3:52 PM
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